Lights, Camera, no fire.

There are no more forecasts with temps near freezing, so I decided today was the day to go live with the TNT and LG heater. I am really anxious to get to work with this machine after all this time and I have some small commercial cleans scheduled for Wed.

The TNT ran flawlessly....all was good there, but I can't say the same for the LG Heater. I ran the TNT for about 10 minutes to fully flush out all the RV antifreeze and make sure all was well. Then I went to light up the LG heater. Gas on, dial set to pilot, pushed plunger several times to purge the air and then held it down while pushing the igniter....nothing.

So, I waited a few minutes and repeated the process only this time chose to go with a BBQ lighter....nothing. There can't be any gas getting to the burner assembly. I didn't smell any gas and verified that the tank was full and that the hose was not pinched off anywhere. So, what is the next move?

The regulator is brand new and the T-Stat Assembly was new 2 years ago, but has sat for most of the time on the garage bench. The igniter, fire eye, and coupler are all new last year as well. I cleaned out all the burner jets before installing the heater as well.

Is there something else that would stop the gas flow other than the T-Stat or Regulator? What am I missing here, before I take it all apart again and start throwing parts at it.

After doing some research, I get the operation better now. I think I will pull the pilot tube and see if there is a blockage and verify gas is flowing past the thermostat. Hopefully, that it will just be something simple like a plugged line.

I think I will save this troubleshooting for tomorrow as it is starting to get dark. With luck, I will have things rocking in time for Wed.

Did you figure this out? I thought you bought a new heater?

I don't think he bought a new heater Mo, I think he went for replacement plumbing lines only ?
Sorry Bob, I don't know anything about LG heater, you should give Ed a call ?

I worked on it this morning.  Gas was flowing past the thermostat control fine, but not reaching the burner.  I removed the assembly and blew air through the pilot tubing and assembly, but I couldn't tell if it was clear....then I screwed up.

I couldn't confirm if the orfice was clear, so I sprayed some carbon cleaner into the assembly and saw that it did drain slowly through it so I should have been good to go, except I also noticed some of the tin near the ingnitor tip was slightly bent and decided to straighten it....half a second later it snapped off.

This assembly:  (That little tin hood on the left side is what snapped off)



So, I just placed another order to replace all the parts except the burner ring.  I will not be cleaning with this truck this week.

Mo wrote:Did you figure this out? I thought you bought a new heater?

I just bought the new coil since I already replaced most of the other parts when I bought the heater originally. Do I regret that? Yup, actually regretting not going with the Northstar heater in the first place.

Can you imagine if we had this much trouble with out water heaters at home?

" Oh dam I have to take cold sowers for a week. My coils ruptured"

I only wish they were built as rugged as my water heater in the house. I still can't believe the low quality of that piece of tin. I barely touched it and it snapped. Just another disappointment with this thing.

did u clean out the pilot orafice with a bristle from a stainless brush?      

Les has it in one of his LG videos.     You take 1 strand from a stainless brush and use it like a welding tip cleaner.  

the smallest welding tip cleaner is far too thick to use on the pilot orafice

Since you own a TNT I would call Les with any LG issues, he knows those units in and out. Hes trouble shooted mine with me several times.

Ive had great luck with LG, our #3 is going on 7 years no issues

I found out that the orifice was too small for even the smallest tip cleaner, but it cleared out with a little air and carb cleaner. I think it would have been fine if that tin shroud wouldn't have snapped off.

The new parts will be here Thursday and I am going to replace the entire pilot assembly. It will get another test by Friday.

Sorry to say this but it seems like you got a "lemon" there Bob

It certainly was a lemon for a heater....and that dealership likely knew it as well. I have not forgotten their role in this matter. At least the parts will be here Thursday and it is a quick fix, so as long as there isn't any bad jets in the burner ring, I should have heat. There really isn't anything left to replace.

Parts arrived, installed, and everything is back together. Naturally, it took some "adjustments" to get it done as the mount holes didn't line up with my bracket, but not a big hurdle.

I am heading out now to give it a try. I can't say that I am very optimistic after all this time, but a pleasant surprise would be appreciated. If you don't hear from me tonight.....I blew up.

Well, there was mostly good news and some minor bad news.

At first, I didn't think the pilot light lit and I kept hitting the striker in disgust before getting down closer and seeing that the pilot was lit...that was good.

I then turned it to on and didn't notice anything for about a second and then "woosh" flame on! I had the dial on the lowest setting and it ran for a about 30 seconds before turning off....looking good.

I increased the temperature...flame on, and I ran the wand wide open for about 5 minutes with killer heat....smiling pretty good now.

Then I noticed some smoke rolling out of the burner opening on the left side. Scratched my head and decided to shut down. I don't know what it was just yet as the Sun was going down, but I am guessing it is the insulation smoldering. Either that or there was some oil or something left on the metal that sits between the burner and coil....minor bad.

I was actually surprise by how hot the side of the heater felt after hearing for years that they didn't get that hot. It was only that way about halfway up the sides and on top of course, but I am starting to re-think my use of hold down straps to anchor the heater.

Tomorrow I will pull off the lid and remove the insulation to see what is going on. The stuff that I used is supposed to be rated for lining chimney cavities, so it shouldn't be burning up. I think I will just remove the lower insulation or else find something better...what-ever that is.

So, the question to you guys that are running these things is this: Would it be safe to continue using the hold down straps or do I need to create metal straps for it?

I went with webbing hold down straps (real thick like a seat belt) so that I could remove it easily for the winter or if I chose to go with a different heater. I did set the hooks about 4 inches away from the sides so the strap is only in contact with the top of the heater.

Everything looks like a green light. The TM is running well, good pump operation, etc., just need the final tweaks on this heater and I will be in business finally.

Hopefully, that will mean by noon tomorrow.

Damn, now I might have to pull the burner ring out one more time!!

The pilot assembly that I received had larger sized mounting holes than my original one which was just held together with sheet metal screws. I couldn't find any bolts that small to fit it and didn't want to drive to town to for 2 small bolts, so I used aluminum rivets instead.

The result was very solid. As a kid, I remember helping my Dad install a new chimney for our lincoln stove and we used aluminum rivets as well as my aluminum cooking pans have riveted handles so I didn't think heat would be a concern.....now I am not so sure.

The plate that holds the pilot assembly is probably 4 inches from the burner ring and although not in the flame, will likely get pretty warm. Aluminum doesn't melt until 1,200 degrees, but the actual flame is probably around 2,000 degrees, so maybe I should worry?

The copper thermocouple would melt at about 2,000 degrees which it doesn't on a water heater and is located right next to the aluminum rivets, so maybe it really doesn't get that hot away from the flame?

I really don't want to pull it apart again, but this is going to bug me now all night.

Looking over my notes some more, that insulation can't be burning. I used the Selkirk Supervent mineral wool insulation which is designed to insulate stove pipes through building materials. I guess I can pull some out so it isn't all the way down the coil, but it is really hard to believe that there is an issue with what I installed.

The rivets are staying put for now, I am tired of taking everything apart on that heater. As the saying goes, it is only a problem when it becomes a problem.

Now the hold down straps might need so re-thinking. I guess I could place an insulation layer between the heater and strap to shield it?? Otherwise it might be time to use some spring steal to strap it down using the same hooks.

Will decide things in the morning. Right now it is 42 degrees outside which has me worried. It wasn't supposed to get lower than 44 tonight, but it has already dipped and you can see your breath outside.

I don't think I can sleep worrying about a surprise freeze event, so I will be staying up to monitor for another hour or so. The van is fully loaded for a later morning job and of course the heater coil / TM on the other truck is unprotected from freezing.

I am really getting sick of this damn weather.

So you think using brackets at bottom of the heater is not enough? I guess it would be more stable using the straps at the top as well.

I thing smoldering might be left over cleaning agent or carbon and will probably burn off in time.

Are you draining the heater at night when its cold?

I just worry that the added swaying of the box truck might be too much for the simple brackets when the coil is full of water...that is why the straps.

I think you are probably correct on the smoldering issue as I did clean up the assembly first and it could just be cooking off. I haven't opened it up yet and I might just fire it up again to see if it goes away.

I didn't drain it last night since there should not be any more freezing temps this time of year and none in the forecast, but hitting 40 was not a good feeling. I stayed up until about 3 am where the temps were still holding at 40 so I went to bed. I think I am going to unload the van and drain out the heater tonight.

I didn't open the heater up again. I took some of that spare insulation and ran an easy test on it. I set it onto an aluminum pan and applied heat from a propane torch directly to it.

I figure the torch is excess of 3,000 degrees (3 times its rating) so it should simulate the burner ring accurately enough. The insulation held up for about 6 seconds before it started to char and melt. It never ignited and really didn't put out any smoke at all...just melted to a slag.



So, what-ever was smoking must be just some residue that should cook off...problem solved. Then I tested the aluminum rivets by holding the torch about 4 inches away from the same kind of rivet. It didn't seem to affect it, but when I moved the torch a little closer, it pretty much melted away, so that will need to be addressed....disappointed by that.

So, I will pull the ring out again to replace the rivets and then I just need to set-up my vac hoses and filter to be ready to go. I have a small house to clean on Saturday so I think it will be a good time to give it the shake-down cruise in the field.

Looking forward to see what kind of heat this thing will deliver after all this time.

To finish this thread off, I ran the TM and heater for about an hour. It took about 10 minutes to cook off what-ever was smoking and then all was good.

The IR Thermometer showed the rivets at a peak temperature of 325 degrees, so I decided to leave them be for now since it is about a third of their temperature limit. It will just be something to keep an eye on and change the next time I need to clean jets.

As for the heat....this thing is a flame thrower! I ran a 75 ft hose to my Mach 15 running 12 flow jets. With the psi at 400 and the LG thermostat at the lowest setting, I was registering 165 degrees at the wand. At middle setting on the thermostat, it hit 195 degrees (at the wand) running wide open and remained steady. I didn't adjust the thermostat any higher and marked those points as my upholstery and carpet settings.

Frankly, it felt a lot hotter than 195 degrees to me, I even had steam coming out of the QC on the TM's panel!! My Butler will hit 200 - 205 at the machine and hover around 180 degrees at the wand or maybe a little more in the Summer. At 195 degrees, I couldn't handle the hoses without thick gloves. I don't know what would happen on the full hot setting and I am not going to try it.

I am guessing that I will need to replace my psi hoses and SO/QC sets far sooner than before with this set-up. Not sure if I like that, but the heat was impressive.